Does Guentzel give Tampa a better shot at a Cup than Stamkos?
The Lightning opted for Jake Guentzel instead of bringing back their captain Steven Stamkos. Does Guentzel give them a better shot at winning the Stanley Cup? 7-Eleven That’s Hockey dives into the debate.
Everyone talks about Stamkos' 40 goals and 81 points, but it's not about statistics. He had 19 goals and 39 points on the PP and I wouldn't mind him scoring half of his points on the power play if it weren't for the fact that the 5v5 offense was mediocre and the 5v5 defense was poor. Let's look at Kucherov. He had 44 goals 144 points, but on the PP he only had 13 goals and 53 points. Point had 46 goals and 90 points, but only had 15 goals and 32 points on the PP. That is a huge difference. As for Nashville, I'm personally curious to see how they're going to use him because Stamkos has to have someone to make plays for him. In Tampa he had Kucherov, but in Nashville? O'Reilly? But then what about Forsberg? Maybe Nyquist, but then they still need a center. Stamkos is not a center anymore.
What a trash take. Stamkos is 35 will be 36 not 34 and scored 40 goals but 20 were on the pp he was a combined -26 his last 2 years. Too much emotion too little facts. He was ABSOLUTELY asking for too much knowing the cap problems. This opened our window for 4 more years or more meanwhile Jake is 30 77 5 years younger and +25 last year. You guys are out of your minds
it really was a matter of steven's career trajectory not matching the team's p-off compete window. he aged out of it while kucherov, point, and vasilevskiy have more to give. so something had to give. either the team handicaps itself to accommodate steven, or he takes a paycut to be a passenger on the team that is going to flow through younger talent.
the guentzel contract likely will age better, but kind of funny to see that stamkos outscored and out produced guentzel (40 goals vs 28) on the surface. reality is, stamkos had 4 less even strength goals than guentzel while playing 12 more games. steven feasted on the PP last year. i'd be shocked if guentzel doesn't break 40 goals and maybe even 100 points if he stays healthy this year and gets time on that PP1. look at the PP numbers.
stamkos was arguably the worst 5v5 skater on the team. as of now, he's basically limited to a great PP sniper while having declining 5v5 production the last 3 years. stammer was getting fed by kuch, and guentzel will likely have a 100 point season if him and kuch stay healthy, if not 100 then very close to it.
+|-plus / minus isn't the best stat but clearly shows how useful they are overall when the gap is a 45 point difference. guentzel also played 12 fewer games then steven.
Imagine being Guentzel coming into a locker room that would rather have the player they let go than you. Tampa seriously screwed up the team chemistry and they are going to stumble out of the gate badly enough to put the playoffs in jeopardy. The players will consider this as disloyalty and it's something they can all expect to be on the receiving end of it at some point.
First of all, it didn't have to be either or…..Brisebois did no negotiations at all with Stamkos or his agent. Stamkos said he was willing to take less to stay.
On ice, Guentzel provides more even strength which is what the lightning need. In the locker room, there's going to be a huge hole. No one can replace him. That said, I still believe it was the right decision.
Off ice, definitely regret these things have indirect consequences. That’s a voice of leadership, the charities he was a champion of , Stamkos was Mr. Tampa Bay, More so than any former Buc, Bolt, or Ray. He deserved a graceful exit. But unless he retired it was always going to be ugly.
That being said, Guentzel is a great move. We have to look at this as two separate events and obtaining him and going and getting proven prospects that’s amazing we need youth after pissing away so many draft picks the last half decade , did I want to lose our guys? No but time & parity always win and we needed to get younger and make tough decisions to maintain relevance and while we have Art Ross , Norris , and Vezina level athletes we shouldn’t waste it. Look at all the great teams of the 2010s most are bottom feeders now, other than Tampa and Boston all other teams required a rebuild since then. With the Panthers clawing at our market share stuff needed to happen, I don’t agree with how they happened and feeling wise I hate it but it still needed to happen
If Guentzel is better than a 34 year old Stamkos, I'm sure people would've been fine with Pittsburgh moving out Crosby and keeping Guentzel too?
Hilarious, the stupidity in these comments. Eyes will be opened this season. Till then, speak your empty words of stupidity. They will disappear like a fart in a hurricane.
Stankos will not have a 40 goal season with Nashville. He barely got to it this past season if it wasn’t for him going off the last month of the season and having kuch pass him the puck. Guentzel can score 50 with kuch easy. Nashville does not have a playmaker as good as kuch to feed Stamkos the puck
I'm not sure what people don't understand here. Jake is BETTER 5v5. He's also 29 years old. Stammer git 8 MIL per year. We CAN'T do that. Tampa made the BETTER move. Sorry about Stammer (I'm a Bolt fan) but JBB made this team BETTER now AND for the future. You also have to consider that the Bolts have ZERO in the wings because they've traded their draft for the NOW. We don't have guys ready to play in the league. Geekie is a STUD but he's 3 years away. JBB has done the best he can be expected to do.
Biron is a tool. He has NO CLUE as to what a GM has to deal with…much less in Tampa with their cap restrictions and future considerations. It's EASY to say that letting Stammer go is a mistake. In a vacuum. What JBB DID DO was make the Bolts better over the LONG TERM. Ask Pittsburgh how those LEGACY CONTRACTS are going for Crosby, Malkin and Letang? Ask them again on 3 years???
Stamkos was a liability defensively. He was given protected minutes. Vast majority of his work comes from the PP. He's lost a step or two easily. Great captain and player. Dont mind losing him to free agency.
23 Comments
How missed will Steven Stamkos be in Tampa?
I hope they regret it
Brutal way to handle stammer, also most points came from pp.
Everyone talks about Stamkos' 40 goals and 81 points, but it's not about statistics. He had 19 goals and 39 points on the PP and I wouldn't mind him scoring half of his points on the power play if it weren't for the fact that the 5v5 offense was mediocre and the 5v5 defense was poor.
Let's look at Kucherov. He had 44 goals 144 points, but on the PP he only had 13 goals and 53 points. Point had 46 goals and 90 points, but only had 15 goals and 32 points on the PP. That is a huge difference.
As for Nashville, I'm personally curious to see how they're going to use him because Stamkos has to have someone to make plays for him. In Tampa he had Kucherov, but in Nashville? O'Reilly? But then what about Forsberg? Maybe Nyquist, but then they still need a center. Stamkos is not a center anymore.
Um……. no comment
Who dons the C at Tampa now?
Gunetzel is overrated AF, carried by Sid for years, hasn't made a defensive play in his entire career.
Guentzel is currently a much better 5v5 player
Guentzel 42 pts in 67 games
Stamkos 32pts in 79 games
What a trash take. Stamkos is 35 will be 36 not 34 and scored 40 goals but 20 were on the pp he was a combined -26 his last 2 years. Too much emotion too little facts. He was ABSOLUTELY asking for too much knowing the cap problems. This opened our window for 4 more years or more meanwhile Jake is 30 77 5 years younger and +25 last year. You guys are out of your minds
it really was a matter of steven's career trajectory not matching the team's p-off compete window. he aged out of it while kucherov, point, and vasilevskiy have more to give. so something had to give. either the team handicaps itself to accommodate steven, or he takes a paycut to be a passenger on the team that is going to flow through younger talent.
the guentzel contract likely will age better, but kind of funny to see that stamkos outscored and out produced guentzel (40 goals vs 28) on the surface. reality is, stamkos had 4 less even strength goals than guentzel while playing 12 more games. steven feasted on the PP last year. i'd be shocked if guentzel doesn't break 40 goals and maybe even 100 points if he stays healthy this year and gets time on that PP1. look at the PP numbers.
guentzel 30G 47A / 5 PPG 17 PPA / +25
stamkos 40G 41A / 19 PPG 20 PPA / -21
stamkos was arguably the worst 5v5 skater on the team. as of now, he's basically limited to a great PP sniper while having declining 5v5 production the last 3 years. stammer was getting fed by kuch, and guentzel will likely have a 100 point season if him and kuch stay healthy, if not 100 then very close to it.
+|-plus / minus isn't the best stat but clearly shows how useful they are overall when the gap is a 45 point difference. guentzel also played 12 fewer games then steven.
He wanted 8 million. JBB didn’t have it.
Imagine being Guentzel coming into a locker room that would rather have the player they let go than you. Tampa seriously screwed up the team chemistry and they are going to stumble out of the gate badly enough to put the playoffs in jeopardy. The players will consider this as disloyalty and it's something they can all expect to be on the receiving end of it at some point.
First of all, it didn't have to be either or…..Brisebois did no negotiations at all with Stamkos or his agent. Stamkos said he was willing to take less to stay.
On ice, Guentzel provides more even strength which is what the lightning need. In the locker room, there's going to be a huge hole. No one can replace him. That said, I still believe it was the right decision.
Off ice, definitely regret these things have indirect consequences. That’s a voice of leadership, the charities he was a champion of , Stamkos was Mr. Tampa Bay, More so than any former Buc, Bolt, or Ray. He deserved a graceful exit. But unless he retired it was always going to be ugly.
That being said, Guentzel is a great move. We have to look at this as two separate events and obtaining him and going and getting proven prospects that’s amazing we need youth after pissing away so many draft picks the last half decade , did I want to lose our guys? No but time & parity always win and we needed to get younger and make tough decisions to maintain relevance and while we have Art Ross , Norris , and Vezina level athletes we shouldn’t waste it. Look at all the great teams of the 2010s most are bottom feeders now, other than Tampa and Boston all other teams required a rebuild since then. With the Panthers clawing at our market share stuff needed to happen, I don’t agree with how they happened and feeling wise I hate it but it still needed to happen
it wasnt one or the other we could have had jake G and stammer while also having money bull shit narrative
Not even close. Great Value Lightning, here we come.
If Guentzel is better than a 34 year old Stamkos, I'm sure people would've been fine with Pittsburgh moving out Crosby and keeping Guentzel too?
Hilarious, the stupidity in these comments. Eyes will be opened this season. Till then, speak your empty words of stupidity. They will disappear like a fart in a hurricane.
Stankos will not have a 40 goal season with Nashville. He barely got to it this past season if it wasn’t for him going off the last month of the season and having kuch pass him the puck. Guentzel can score 50 with kuch easy. Nashville does not have a playmaker as good as kuch to feed Stamkos the puck
I'm not sure what people don't understand here. Jake is BETTER 5v5. He's also 29 years old. Stammer git 8 MIL per year. We CAN'T do that. Tampa made the BETTER move. Sorry about Stammer (I'm a Bolt fan) but JBB made this team BETTER now AND for the future. You also have to consider that the Bolts have ZERO in the wings because they've traded their draft for the NOW. We don't have guys ready to play in the league. Geekie is a STUD but he's 3 years away. JBB has done the best he can be expected to do.
Biron is a tool. He has NO CLUE as to what a GM has to deal with…much less in Tampa with their cap restrictions and future considerations. It's EASY to say that letting Stammer go is a mistake. In a vacuum. What JBB DID DO was make the Bolts better over the LONG TERM. Ask Pittsburgh how those LEGACY CONTRACTS are going for Crosby, Malkin and Letang? Ask them again on 3 years???
Stamkos was a liability defensively. He was given protected minutes. Vast majority of his work comes from the PP. He's lost a step or two easily. Great captain and player. Dont mind losing him to free agency.
You take Guentzel and Mcdonaugh. We will gladly take Stamkos and Marchessault. Go Preds!