Hey all, wanted to talk about these two as I see a lot of suggestions for trading either player and their contracts make such a move very difficult until the flat cap is over with.
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30 Comments
Put Miller on waivers and send him to Abottsford! If we lose him oh well
The JT MIller that I have been following since he was with the Rangers is one that desperately wants to win. He has a lot of skill and if you surround him with talent that can finish you will see good things. Otherwise why would Boudreau put him on the number one PP unit. His passes are crisp and he scores at a regular pace. What is happening here is that the entire team is not playing well. At least we got a win tonight. If we pull off a 10 game winning streak it would be a different story. This is a 23 man roster. You can't put this all on JT
The Canucks had a chance to trade Miller 6 months ago at peak value. Or at the very least, just not resign him until the end of this season IF he put up similar numbers again.
But no!! They sign him to a monster 8-year deal at 8 million a season. To make things so much worse, the contract is both untradable and buy-out proof. So they hand out this very risky contract with no safety net. It is just infuriating when you think of it!!
I think all the JT drama will go down a lot when Horvat is gone. For whatever reason Horvat vs Miller has been a thing even dating back previous seasons.
As a Rangers fan, when Shannon mentioned Karlsson to the Rangers, I had a horrible moment. Thankfully, he was just using them as a hypothetical and not as a serious possibility. At least I hope he was!
I'm sure lots of teams would love to have Karlsson, but that contract isn't going anywhere.
I can't imagine anyone in market for Karlsson. His play this year vs recent years is bizarre…. And yes I'm kicking myself for drafting and dropping him with my last fantasy pick at season start for Montour haha. His age and recent history show this is more likely an outlier than anything, and at that price is it worth a huge gamble? A GM about to be fired if the team fails to make the playoffs may bite, but anyone set for a few years won't.
Miller is stuck with the Canucks, and that is all there is to it. He will be a 65-75 point a year player for the next three to five years (barring injuries), and that is just how it will be. Do the math, crunch the numbers. And it really is as simple as that. Can he accumulate a higher seasonal point total? Yes, as long as he is on a producing line.
Scrolled a hundred comments and no one is talking about the cat sleeping in the background or how glorious the Sharks retros are. Disappointed.
SJ retain 4-4.5M? That seems excessive even if we treat this bounce back season as an anomaly. If healthy normal mode Karlsson is 65-75 points (avg over the next 4 seasons), that is worth 9M so a more reasonable salary retention would be 2-2.5M.
If you can trade Miller plus a slight sweetener to be able to keep Horvat then that is a net win. Losing Horvat and keeping a toxic player in Miller around the young players the Canucks core are is dangerous for longterm development.
The Miller signing had very little foresight involved it seemed. Why resign a player who just came off a career year and still had one year left at a good cap hit, management could have let the year play out and see 1) where the team is in the standings and whether playoffs was reasonable 2) whether JT Miller was continuing his good play or not and earning his longterm deal with consistency 3) what the trade offers were for Miller 4) what the options were with Horvat for signing or trading and compare the two players on both… If Miller played well either he deserves the new contract even more and maybe asks for a higher number but the certainty of production is better or he increases his trade value for the deadline if the team is out of the playoffs. If Miller played poorly his contract would go down or he would still be worth something decent in trade as a rental based off his past production anyways. Not signing Miller created a win-win and signing him put us in a lose-lose where he is now part of a core of overpaid players that can't win enough in Miller, OEL, Myers, even Boeser could be put in the group almost. 25-30 million in overpaid players doesn't equal success on any team.
I genuinely think AQ forced the extension. Just no logic or contextual awareness to the signing. Even if he was playing well he didn't fit the teams window. Baffled me when it happened.
I think if Mike Grier moves Karlsson it won't sit well with much of what's been done nearing the end of Doug Wilson's tenure as well as it being his first season as GM and might loom on the organization for whatever that's worth,
Either way I think Grier would be apprehensive to trade Karlsson, especially with retaining a substantial cap hit as the Sharks have so much in dead money affecting their salary cap plaguing the team already.
Karlsson also won the Norris in 2012.
I totally agree that JT is untradeable.
The kicker with me is JT's attitude, leadership ability (or the lack therefore). I was guilty of being one of those people that thought last year, it was "playing with a chip on his shoulder". Allix Grant actually pointed this out to me and I didn't see it. Now, especially with the thought of Horvat getting traded and thus losing that locker room presence, I'm very worried about the attitude that JT might bring to the team and younger players.
This is why I'd support if management traded Boeser (for a reasonable return), and/or Kuzmenko (for a great return), but I can't support the idea of trading Horvat (unless the return is HUGE) because I'm worried that If you trade Horvat and have to keep JT, you might lose the locker room and leadership balance, with a then, younger, rebuilding Canucks team.
I think of the two, Karlsson is more likely to be moved. He is still one of the best. JT will be canuck for a long time, you cant trade that contract.
The Miller deal was signed 3 months ago and already immovable? That’s a yikes.
I did not know about the 15 team no trade list, I knew it was an awful deal by Canucks management but that just makes it even more brutal oh my goodness.
I really like the thumbnail
Pretty common sense that they should have traded miller in the off-season. A long term contract for miller was never going to age well.
JT Miller's defensive knowledge is similar to Europeans in 1490 of North America. He's atrocious that way. Karlsson's a meh defensively, offensively he's on a heater.
I don't love the Canucks so I'm just watching them, Miller is a cancer as far as I'm concerned, yelling at the goalie who was saving his butt in that game. Miller couldn't be bothered to Backcheck.
There is absolutely zero chance Miller gets moved even within the next 3-4 years. That contract hasn’t even started yet, if you’re a Canucks fan and actually think they’ll quickly move on from this you’re delusional
This is why I remove the cap from my NHL 22 franchises
I can see Miller scoring 85-90 points next season and Horvat scoring 60. Just the way it goes after pressure of huge new deal.
Miller for Karlsson, pair him with Quinn Hughes or even OEL. Miller will have a team full of bums he can whip into shape.
I wouldnt mind seeing Philadelphia trade for JT at 6m/y(retain 25%) for the 8 years.
JT Miller is such diva