Thomas Drance on Anthony Beauvillier, Andrei Kuzmenko and more
Thomas Drance from The Athletic on Anthony Beauvillier’s performance since coming over from the Islanders, Andrei Kuzmenko’s first Canucks season and more.
Drance knows that baseline negativity is his most useful strategy — after all, it would take a high level of success to make him look silly, and by then, he can have adjusted his line in such a manner as to provide reasons why things didn't turn out quite as badly as he'd predicted; besides which, you can always count on the fact that most people have short memories anyway. In the meantime, each and every decision will be measured against a "might have been" so much better if they'd only listened to him, which, of course, can never be proven. The odds will always be in your favour if you're comparing the present with a future paradise, a magical, mystical place in the dim future, stocked with lots of high draft choices who've all turned out to be franchise players. If they don't, you can always blame the scouting.
Drance wasn't wrong. I would have hated to see Kuzmenko go. I am glad he's still here because he is a bright light on that team. But the reality is they should have tanked. It sounds like they talked to Hughes and Pettersson who said they wouldn't be happy if the Canucks started a rebuild, so the Canucks pivoted to a retool. They are a middling team who is retooling. They are not a great team going down, who is deciding to retool to try to stay great.
The other thing about the Drance approach is that it entirely ignores human psychology, a.k.a. coaching and development. Players are just assets which you shuffle around in an abstract space. In the real world, human beings can grow and improve, or stagnate and decline, depending on the environment that they're in. I realise that the term "culture" is overused, but it does mean something. What becomes of your assets is hugely variable. This is one reason why tanking can perpetuate itself.
Sorry Drance but you cannot get good if you do not sign players like Kuzmenko, trading for Hronek, acquiring Beauvilier etc. So unless you you want to completely clean house and trade Demko, Miller, Petterson and Hughes to finish last for a few years with no guarantee of a rebuild like that working then whatever. I would rather see this management group try to re-toll this team with the core talent we have first. If they can't then all these players will still have a tremendous amount of trade value for pics.
Character assassination ? Wow. I mean I've seen a little but I can read it as mostly people relieved the trades looked pretty good for us. I haven't seen much in the way of really negative comments about Bo. I'll admit I saw the occasional one when he was here even certainly more than I see now.
I find Drance kind of sanctimonious, but I rarely disagree with his takes. One question I asked on Twitter, which he dodged as a false dichotomy, was — how do you expect this team to rebuild while retaining EP & QH? Presumably, they are going to put 80 million in front of EP this summer. Which is more convincing, saying A) next year will be more of the same minus Horvat, but we have a boatload of pics and will have all kinds of young kids coming to help in an unknown number of years, or B) we’re converting Horvat into good younger players at all three skater positions, including a legit top 4 RHD, and will still have six picks in the first four rounds (more if they can convert one of BB or CG)..?
If you wanna argue for a rebuild then trading EP/QH should be on the table, but it never was. The time to rebuild was 3–4 years ago, or in 3–4 years from now. Now they have to play the EP/QH/TD hand they find themselves in the middle of. 94 and 11 show they can build a contender with fewer draft picks, even though agree , it’s uphill. I’ll feel a lot better about it if they can rob some people in trades, starting maybe with Kravtsov…
Sorry you don't trade 40 goal scorers EVER. Full stop! No matter where you are in the "rebuild" or "retool" process. The return you were asking for is never going to replace a first line player. Also Drancers approach never takes into account the damage done to the teams reputation and ability to recruit and sign future KHL, NCAA and free agents if players are going to get shipped out after half a season. Let's be honest, the organization already has a few black eyes and doesn't need anymore scandal or controversy. This take doesn't need to go to a referendum for next year if they win two rounds Drancer is wrong now. Ridiculous conversation.
Trading every good player for picks is a losing strategy. Just ask Edmonton(2 decades of losing) Phoenix(never done anything) Florida (couple playoffs) and the list goes on and on. Trying to replicate what hockey geniuses do once in a decade is a fools errand. The only way to improve a hockey team is incrementally putting all the pieces together through a combination of draft trade and sign.
Don’t anyone shit on Bo Horvat. That man was a consummate pro in Vancouver and will always be held on a pedestal. Drancer is usually right. In this case he’s bang on.
Whomever speaks 3rd person Drance, please explain it's a re-tool tool. Two rounds in two years, so your take is wrong, wrong time, frame, wrong stated objective Drama Drance
Canucks don't want a rebuild, so they were never gonna trade Kuz for picks. Re-signing Pety, Kuz, and maybe Beauvillier are problems for next year and beyond…
Can you explain to me why Tochett is hell bent to play his star players through the wall every night when we are out of the playoffs. Is this his ego driving this insanity making Canuck fans think we are a playoff contender next year. The playoffs are made in the first 50 games of the season. Ex hockey players have said time and time again in the last few weeks the Canucks are playing so well is because there is no pressure to win. They are all playing loose and having fun. This is why you are seeing Calgary, Ottawa, Buffalo loosing its because they are feeling the pressure of the situation. Instead of playing the young kids Tochett is hell bent on playing Hughes, Petterson, Miller over 25 minutes a game. Playing Demko as if the playoffs are on the line. And all for what? Setting a culture for next year. We know what we have in our star players. Play the young guys with the stars and see what we have instead of 10 minutes a night. What a joke this management team is. Its their way of torturing the Canuck fans. Lets finish as high as we can in the standings so we make sure we are mediocre for the next 10 years but no worries the season ticket holders are all suckers they keep renewing their season tickets so all good in Canucks land. Sorry had to vent for a bit. Its beyond frustrating!
I find it funny that when the Canucks were falling in the standing, everyone agreed with Thomas Drance, and when the team started winning some meaningless games, they started criticizing Drance for the same take. I remember Drance saying at Boudreau's firing that, given the Canucks' easy schedule to conclude the season, they will naturally have a better record. The Canucks are still loaded with wingers and not much in the way of defence. The construction of this team continued to be flawed and nothing significant has changed. So until the brass can actually address the makeup of this team, Drance's criticism of the team spending so much resources signing wingers should be considered valid.
49 Comments
Drance is the best guest they have. I love their discussions and the back and forth banter.
Drance never admits he was wrong about anything..
Canucks are winning easier cause so many, other teams, are tanking. Deflated competitive environment is not a true indicator of future success.
Drance wants a rebuild, thats not right or wrong, he just has to realize that the owner isnt going to do that, and move on.
That Drance, so wushu washy, never has a stance that he believes in ! Oh wait
Having Thomas Drance covering this team doesn't make sense for this team.
Drance seems to forget he's a journalist, and doesn't work for an NHL team anymore. I can clearly see why he will never again.
Rick you get it. This is about the next free agent.
Drance is right, best guest these guys have. This team is never going to win the cup, stuck in the middle
this team was never going to rebuild. Drance has to accept this fact. Get with the program Drance
Does Drance even enjoy watching the Canucks? All he does is complain about decisions management makes and yammer on about how he's always right.
Drance is the worst! Come up with something new! Quit repeating the same garbage over and over every week!
“Kuz isn’t a rookie” – Drance
This guy is such a moron!
Drance, would you score on Pettersson's wing?
For the next two years Kuzmenko may be one reason to buy a ticket
How can anyone enjoy watching this dough head .
The way you guys get each other all riled up is so damn funny rofl
Meyer's 1st-period giveaway opened the door for the Coyotes. Bummer.
Drance knows that baseline negativity is his most useful strategy — after all, it would take a high level of success to make him look silly, and by then, he can have adjusted his line in such a manner as to provide reasons why things didn't turn out quite as badly as he'd predicted; besides which, you can always count on the fact that most people have short memories anyway. In the meantime, each and every decision will be measured against a "might have been" so much better if they'd only listened to him, which, of course, can never be proven. The odds will always be in your favour if you're comparing the present with a future paradise, a magical, mystical place in the dim future, stocked with lots of high draft choices who've all turned out to be franchise players. If they don't, you can always blame the scouting.
Drance wasn't wrong. I would have hated to see Kuzmenko go. I am glad he's still here because he is a bright light on that team. But the reality is they should have tanked. It sounds like they talked to Hughes and Pettersson who said they wouldn't be happy if the Canucks started a rebuild, so the Canucks pivoted to a retool. They are a middling team who is retooling. They are not a great team going down, who is deciding to retool to try to stay great.
The other thing about the Drance approach is that it entirely ignores human psychology, a.k.a. coaching and development. Players are just assets which you shuffle around in an abstract space. In the real world, human beings can grow and improve, or stagnate and decline, depending on the environment that they're in. I realise that the term "culture" is overused, but it does mean something. What becomes of your assets is hugely variable. This is one reason why tanking can perpetuate itself.
Great show. Thomas has long term view with the goal of winning a cup!
Sorry Drance but you cannot get good if you do not sign players like Kuzmenko, trading for Hronek, acquiring Beauvilier etc. So unless you you want to completely clean house and trade Demko, Miller, Petterson and Hughes to finish last for a few years with no guarantee of a rebuild like that working then whatever. I would rather see this management group try to re-toll this team with the core talent we have first. If they can't then all these players will still have a tremendous amount of trade value for pics.
Drance has verbal diarrhea!
"The top 6 didn't do much, though the Pettersson line scored twice." LOL. Nice analysis, Drance.
Character assassination ? Wow. I mean I've seen a little but I can read it as mostly people relieved the trades looked pretty good for us. I haven't seen much in the way of really negative comments about Bo. I'll admit I saw the occasional one when he was here even certainly more than I see now.
I find Drance kind of sanctimonious, but I rarely disagree with his takes. One question I asked on Twitter, which he dodged as a false dichotomy, was — how do you expect this team to rebuild while retaining EP & QH? Presumably, they are going to put 80 million in front of EP this summer. Which is more convincing, saying A) next year will be more of the same minus Horvat, but we have a boatload of pics and will have all kinds of young kids coming to help in an unknown number of years, or B) we’re converting Horvat into good younger players at all three skater positions, including a legit top 4 RHD, and will still have six picks in the first four rounds (more if they can convert one of BB or CG)..?
If you wanna argue for a rebuild then trading EP/QH should be on the table, but it never was. The time to rebuild was 3–4 years ago, or in 3–4 years from now. Now they have to play the EP/QH/TD hand they find themselves in the middle of. 94 and 11 show they can build a contender with fewer draft picks, even though agree , it’s uphill. I’ll feel a lot better about it if they can rob some people in trades, starting maybe with Kravtsov…
Bo got paid, so natural tendency is to take foot off the gas…
"Character assasination" of Bo Horvat is a little heavy-handed lol
Sorry you don't trade 40 goal scorers EVER. Full stop! No matter where you are in the "rebuild" or "retool" process. The return you were asking for is never going to replace a first line player. Also Drancers approach never takes into account the damage done to the teams reputation and ability to recruit and sign future KHL, NCAA and free agents if players are going to get shipped out after half a season. Let's be honest, the organization already has a few black eyes and doesn't need anymore scandal or controversy. This take doesn't need to go to a referendum for next year if they win two rounds Drancer is wrong now. Ridiculous conversation.
"fact free fantasy" he says while completely ignoring all the facts…what a dipshit
Horvat was traded to produce for ny, hes not.
Whats with the cock and bull
Kuzmenko is a great signing
Trading every good player for picks is a losing strategy. Just ask Edmonton(2 decades of losing) Phoenix(never done anything) Florida (couple playoffs) and the list goes on and on. Trying to replicate what hockey geniuses do once in a decade is a fools errand. The only way to improve a hockey team is incrementally putting all the pieces together through a combination of draft trade and sign.
Thos te is not that good period win a few gamrs when it doesnt matter and there a playoff team Newsflash there not in the playoffs next year either
Don’t anyone shit on Bo Horvat. That man was a consummate pro in Vancouver and will always be held on a pedestal. Drancer is usually right. In this case he’s bang on.
This one was a little hard to watch and follow.
Drance should be GM
Whomever speaks 3rd person Drance, please explain it's a re-tool tool. Two rounds in two years, so your take is wrong, wrong time, frame, wrong stated objective Drama Drance
Agree 100% with Drance. This team will suck for ever
Canucks don't want a rebuild, so they were never gonna trade Kuz for picks. Re-signing Pety, Kuz, and maybe Beauvillier are problems for next year and beyond…
I enjoy Drance's interview with Don and Rick. Makes me smile when they make fun of each other.
Once again I agree with Drance on the kuzmenko take. Uneducated fans with very surface level analysis of what the team needs.
drancer just a weee bit arrogant. looking forward to his future tenure as NHL GM.
Can you explain to me why Tochett is hell bent to play his star players through the wall every night when we are out of the playoffs. Is this his ego driving this insanity making Canuck fans think we are a playoff contender next year. The playoffs are made in the first 50 games of the season. Ex hockey players have said time and time again in the last few weeks the Canucks are playing so well is because there is no pressure to win. They are all playing loose and having fun. This is why you are seeing Calgary, Ottawa, Buffalo loosing its because they are feeling the pressure of the situation. Instead of playing the young kids Tochett is hell bent on playing Hughes, Petterson, Miller over 25 minutes a game. Playing Demko as if the playoffs are on the line. And all for what? Setting a culture for next year. We know what we have in our star players. Play the young guys with the stars and see what we have instead of 10 minutes a night. What a joke this management team is. Its their way of torturing the Canuck fans. Lets finish as high as we can in the standings so we make sure we are mediocre for the next 10 years but no worries the season ticket holders are all suckers they keep renewing their season tickets so all good in Canucks land. Sorry had to vent for a bit. Its beyond frustrating!
Drance is a walking L
I find it funny that when the Canucks were falling in the standing, everyone agreed with Thomas Drance, and when the team started winning some meaningless games, they started criticizing Drance for the same take. I remember Drance saying at Boudreau's firing that, given the Canucks' easy schedule to conclude the season, they will naturally have a better record. The Canucks are still loaded with wingers and not much in the way of defence. The construction of this team continued to be flawed and nothing significant has changed. So until the brass can actually address the makeup of this team, Drance's criticism of the team spending so much resources signing wingers should be considered valid.
I guarantee you that hockey fans pay their hard earn money to see the Canucks tank at Rogers arena and lose nightly as Drance advocates all the time.
Drance would trade a 35 goal scorer for a pie in the sky😂